Andrea Mango [00:00:00]:
When you give up a little bit of that power and you’re giving them that choice, know that’s where they get engaged. The lessons that I do that I feel like, wow, I feel amazing as a teacher, are those ones where I’m truly just a facilitator?

Cyndi Burnett [00:00:15]:
Hello, everyone. My name is Dr. Cindy Burnett.

Matthew Worwood [00:00:18]:
And my name is Dr. Matthew Werwood.

Cyndi Burnett [00:00:20]:
This is the fueling creativity and Education podcast.

Matthew Worwood [00:00:24]:
On this show, we’ll be talking about creativity topics and how they apply to the field of education.

Cyndi Burnett [00:00:29]:
We’ll be speaking with scholars, educators, and resident experts about their work, challenges they face, and digging deeper into new and varying perspectives of creativity, all with the.

Matthew Worwood [00:00:40]:
Goal to help fuel the more rich and informed discussion that provides teachers and parents with knowledge they can use at home or in the classroom.

Cyndi Burnett [00:00:48]:
So let’s begin today. We welcome to the show Andrea Mango. Andrea has been an elementary school educator for the last 18 years, first in kindergarten through second grade, and currently for the last two years as a steam educator, all at Dodge elementary in Williamsville, New York. She has a master’s degree in elementary education and a BFA in theater, which is actually where Andrea and I met nearly 30 years ago. So for the last ten years, Andrea has been my personal bridge between the theories and research studies done in the field of creativity to the practical implications of the classroom. Additionally, and she doesn’t know this based on the many stories she has shared with me about teaching, she is my model for how to be a creative educator. So given the goal of this podcast is to bridge the gap, I really wanted to bring Andrea onto our podcast to discuss some of the things she does in her classroom and relate it back to some of the conversations with our other guests. So welcome to the show, Andrea.

Andrea Mango [00:01:52]:
Thank you so much for that wonderful introduction, Cindy.

Cyndi Burnett [00:01:55]:
Andrea, we have spoken a lot about giving students the opportunity for choice in the classroom. And can you begin by sharing some of the barriers to bringing choice into the classroom and some ways in which you’ve overcome those barriers?

Andrea Mango [00:02:11]:
Well, I definitely want to first address that. I think that teachers are trying their hardest. They really are trying so hard. Especially, I’ve done most of my teaching in elementary, and there’s a lot of teacher guilt if they can’t get everything done. But I think we want to really push so much choice for students in the classroom. But the truth of the matter is really that most teachers don’t have a lot of choice. Sure, they can deliver material in different ways, but I think a big hindrance for them is there are programs for everything they have to teach. And oftentimes there’s even a schedule that they have to be on that has to be done at a certain time if they’re not at the same page or the same lesson as other teachers.

Andrea Mango [00:02:54]:
So I think keeping that pace puts a huge strain on teachers creativity and being able to step outside of the realm of what they’re teaching, even, in fact, some programs, too. You really have to know the program a couple of years before you can deviate from it and start to be creative, just so you understand where it’s going. So I think that really holds teachers.

Matthew Worwood [00:03:16]:
Back, building on some of those realities. One of the things that strikes me when I work with teachers is that just when you think you’re getting used to a program and maybe developing the confidence or room to deviate, a new program emerges and you’re once again back to the drawing board and having to learn something new again. I mean, is that something you felt?

Andrea Mango [00:03:35]:
Absolutely. I think teachers all over the country are feeling that probably even all over the world. Right? But I feel like, not to put such a downer, like, oh, no, these poor teachers. It is a little poor teachers, but so many teachers are creative. And I know Cindy wanted me to share some of the ways that I was kind of giving choice and that agency for kids. And one thing I started about seven years ago is I started flexible seating. So for those that might not know, I had these neo rock chairs that kids could sit on, actual rocking chairs, actually. I’ve even had beach chairs.

Andrea Mango [00:04:11]:
I had pop up tents. I had pillows, I had beanbags. And so kids were able to choose how they wanted to learn, like where they wanted to learn in a space that was comfortable. And believe it or not, that actually added a lot to the students. And just for any teachers are out there thinking about chaos in the room, you can control it depending on your class and how they are. That year sort of as a whole. Like, I’ve had things where they had to sign up every day for what they were going to work in or once a week or even picking popsicle sticks and having to put a little magnet where their picture is. So just even giving kids that choice of where they’re going to sit or how they’re going to learn is a great way to infuse it and has nothing to do with curriculum.

Matthew Worwood [00:04:54]:
I love that. And I tell you why I love that is I remember we’ve actually got COVID Artwell coming into season six to talk about his new book. But in season one, one of the things that he said is that despite the fact that there are many constraints in the classroom environment and the curriculum, there are certain opportunities for you to do different things. And he spoke specifically about the setup of the furniture in the room. And it’s just amazing to suddenly think about rocking chairs and beanbags and giving students the choice on what space they want to go into learn and to build on that.

Cyndi Burnett [00:05:28]:
Matt, I also remember Calvurn saying he was going into classrooms when he went into a new school and saying, is there a reason why all the desks are in this format? And all the teachers said, no, that’s just what we thought we should do. And to really question why is it that we have to have students in these particular seats, or why is it that they have to be in rows in the classroom, so really questioning their own methods and strategies for teaching?

Andrea Mango [00:05:57]:
And, Cindy, I feel like what you just said is we’re so in sync. It’s exactly where I feel like I make a lot of my creativity decisions in the classroom. It’s that why does it have to be like that? Do all of the students have to be making the craft the same? Now, I teach steam, which is science, technology, engineering, arts and math, and I teach it to K to four. And so there’s so many opportunities for choice, so many opportunities for creativity for me, for the kids. But when I was in the regular general classroom, I would sort of structure a craft even the same way that I do my steam lessons right now. So let’s say it’s April and spring. You’re thinking flowers, we want to decorate the hallway or something like that. So here it is.

Andrea Mango [00:06:49]:
Well, you have to have a stem. You have to have leaves. You have to have a flower. At one point, I did one where you have to make a vase, you could have any background. You have to have at least one flower. You could add birds. You could add this. Why does it have to be a pattern, especially at the time I was working with second graders? Why do they have to have a pattern? Why do they all have to look the same as long as you have the criteria? And I think that that’s another place that teachers can open up.

Andrea Mango [00:07:21]:
It’s one of those, why do they have to do that? Why does everybody have to be the same all of the time?

Matthew Worwood [00:07:28]:
I love that. And I can relate to the fact that I’ve walked into my children’s classes and sometimes said, why do all of these images or pictures look the same? And I asked myself, is that the curriculum, saying that they have to follow those steps or is it that the activity is taking everyone in the same direction?

Andrea Mango [00:07:49]:
I think another thing too, Matt, that is, with teachers especially, there’s this big kind of stigma in a way, like everything should look neat. If everything looks neat and tidy and put together, that means you’re a good teacher. That means you have control of your class. Whereas there were times where I’ve had them do the same stem activity of craft, of pumpkins, and one was like a three dimensional pumpkin, and I hung it in the hall. One was like a scary pumpkin. It doesn’t always look neat and conformed and put together. So that creativity isn’t always neat, it’s sometimes messy. And sometimes teachers, especially if they’re not tenured, if they haven’t been there very long, they may feel nervous about how is that portraying me as a teacher? Which, it’s two separate things, but that unfortunately, I feel like it’s almost like a don’t judge a book by its cover.

Andrea Mango [00:08:47]:
But sometimes I think teachers feel that pressure.

Cyndi Burnett [00:08:51]:
That also reminds me of a conversation that we’ve had, Andrea, in the past about vulnerability of educators and how I remember when you were starting your steam classroom and you were trying all these things, but it’s like when you’re trying something new and it looks messy, you feel vulnerable, like, are other people judging you? Are parents judging you? Are even students judging you? So how do you deal with that? How do you deal with that vulnerability of being a creative know?

Andrea Mango [00:09:18]:
Thankfully, I do have a supportive staff. They kind of know me by now. But it was like Cindy said, I was taking over to start a brand new program, steam, and nobody had really done anything before with it. And so it was something. I was taking over half of the library, too. And I knew some of the kids remembered, even though it was COVID and things like that, they did remember the space as a library, and I’m still attached to the other part of the library. So I have three giant poles in the middle of the room and electrical poles. And it was like, how am I going to make this a space that is going to inspire kids? In my head, I saw the whole thing, and I think that’s what really drove me to continue, Cindy, is I knew that once I got everything up, it would be awesome, and the kids would feel so inspired and encouraged and they would know that it was a place that they could take risks.

Andrea Mango [00:10:10]:
But while I was putting my cardboard robot up that covered one whole pole in the room, or my spacecraft that’s shooting up with tool hanging out the bottom and lights and things and giant paper flowers and things like that. It was kind of scary because I know that not everyone thinks the way I do, and some people will think that’s going to distract the kids or why do we have to do that sort of thing? So I’m so glad that I trusted my gut because it really is something that I think brings a lot to the program. Even the flexible seating. It was seven years ago. I thankfully had a principal that was supportive because I said, this is what I want to do with my classroom. And everybody else had desks. Everybody else had desks. They were in rows or in groups, and I looked a lot different than every other classroom.

Andrea Mango [00:11:05]:
But thankfully, now I love to say that my school, like almost every classroom, has different flexible seating options, and it’s what’s right for kids. Why not let them wiggle? And there’s so much research on it, too, that’s beneficial.

Matthew Worwood [00:11:19]:
Did you pay for the furniture or did the school pay for the furniture? Because my gut feeling is some teachers might be wondering that right now.

Andrea Mango [00:11:26]:
Yes, that’s a really good question. So it was a little bit of everything. I actually got a grant from my district. It’s like our Williamsville foundation grant for teachers. So I was able to get a grant for about $500 worth. It is very expensive. I used any budget money, extra budget money that I was given as a classroom teacher, a lot of my own money. And then really anytime I’d turn around, I could see the potential of flexible seating in anything.

Andrea Mango [00:11:55]:
So I had old tables that I had bought, like I said, beach chairs and things like that. So it doesn’t have to be all fancy things. But the grant really did help. And then, of course, once my principal kind of saw my vision, he threw me a little bit of extra here and there so that I could get more like neo rock chairs, which could be almost $100 each. So it can be very expensive, but I think definitely worth it.

Cyndi Burnett [00:12:19]:
So, Andrew, you mentioned a lot about the physical environment. I want to move a little bit to the psychological environment because we’ve talked a lot on the show about culture and the creative environment, the psychological creative environment for creativity. So how do you build a safe and trusting environment for creativity to thrive in your classroom?

Andrea Mango [00:12:42]:
And I love that you asked that, Cindy, because it really is so important. Before I got into the regular classroom, I actually worked for our board of cooperative education through BOCES, and it was a program called the Positive Youth Development center. It was an amazing program. It doesn’t even exist anymore. But I trained teachers, and I also worked with middle and high school kids. But one of the things we used, William Glasser’s choice theory, and I feel like that was kind of like a foundation for me. So it’s his whole five basic know the idea that kids need love and belonging. They need to feel like they have survival, so they have enough food in their belly, they have enough water, and they’ve had enough sleep, that they have power, they have freedom, and they can have fun in the classroom.

Andrea Mango [00:13:27]:
So I feel like that’s always been underlying current throughout things that I do in the classroom, because if a student doesn’t feel comfortable in the classroom, they’re not going to be able to be creative. If they feel like you have too many rules, if you have too many restrictions, if you’re all in straight rows, they’re going to be too worried to be creative. They’re going to be worried. What is Mrs. Mango thinking? Why is she going to accept this? They’re not really going to be able to be as creative. Even when I’m teaching steam, it’s very rare, because everything that I do in steam, I do implement the science standards, and I do a lot of problem solving with them and collaborative activities where they have to work together. But when we’re working together in the steam lab, it’s exciting, it’s different, it’s hands on. There’s very rare that kids don’t want to do the activities, but if they do, there’s always kind of this thought in my head, like they might not be in the right mindset.

Andrea Mango [00:14:25]:
We’ve all had that day where you’re just not feeling it. So oftentimes, if a student doesn’t want to do an activity in my steam lab, I’ll say, it’s okay. You can sit out, you can watch your friends, you can help them. Sometimes they’ll end up joining after a little while when they feel like they’ve gotten comfortable. Sometimes they have missed the whole activity. If it continued, it would be definitely something that I address. But sometimes just getting a kid involved in a different way. I had a third grader, we were making catapults the other day, and he always goes along with everything we’re doing.

Andrea Mango [00:14:58]:
He’s always really excited, but isn’t feeling it. And I said, hey, that’s okay, you don’t have to do the activity. How about, you could be like the helper? Could you go around and help people if they need it? And so I told the whole class, I’m like, he’s going to be our helper if you need anything. And then when kids were coming up to me asking for stuff, I was like, all right, this is a job for our helper student and got him involved. When we ended up testing the catapults, he was the one that counted everybody down, three, two, one. So he was completely involved. He saw the whole learning goal. He nailed it, but he did it in a different way.

Andrea Mango [00:15:32]:
And I feel like if I forced him next time he came into the steam lab, he would feel a little bit of that anxiety from, oh, she’s going to force me to do it again. What if I can’t come up with an idea what’s going on? So I think that’s really important, that students feel safe and welcome and that their ideas count.

Matthew Worwood [00:15:49]:
So, Andrea, you spoke about how you accommodate students that sometimes just aren’t feeling it today. And I really commend you for a being able to identify that and observe that in your students and then being willing to allow them to just feel off today. But it strikes me that there’s a connection between what you’re saying and the challenge of sometimes engaging students in work that they just don’t want to do. And we’ve had people on the show talk a lot about interests and personalized interest projects. And project based learning is a great way to engage students. But still, sometimes students just aren’t feeling the topic or they may not necessarily want to work with this particular group of students. And sometimes it can be really hard to engage students who are walking through the classroom saying, you know what? It’s not just today. I just don’t want to do this thing.

Matthew Worwood [00:16:38]:
Do you have any advice for educators around that challenge?

Andrea Mango [00:16:42]:
You know what? Absolutely. Teaching 18 years, you absolutely come across that. And one of the ways that I feel, going back to what we just talked about earlier about, do they all have to do the same thing? Like, if it is a topic that they have to learn about, do you all have to write about it? Could they instead make a poster about it? Could it be something where someone makes a video or someone writes a poem? So thinking about this, I actually just had this conversation with one of my colleagues who is, she’s extremely creative. She is open to so many things. She’s always reflective. And she was frustrated with one of the grade levels because they were making reviews about books they were reading. And she said, just some of them just don’t want to do the writing part. And I said, well, what is it you need them to do? Could they do it in different ways? And she was like, oh, yeah, I guess she wants some of these to be entered into this computer program so she would get enough of them.

Andrea Mango [00:17:44]:
But she said, yeah, I guess you’re right. And I think really where it kind of comes down to, too, is that power. Can teachers give up a little bit of power? Because sometimes when kids are given a little bit of power and it’s different than control, you’re not losing control of the class. But when you give up a little bit of that power and you’re giving them that choice again, that’s where they get engaged. The lessons that I do that, I feel like, wow, I feel amazing as a teacher. Are those ones where I’m truly just a facilitator? I’m giving them a job, and they are going off. They are completely in charge. I’m literally just a gopher going, okay, can I get you a coffee with that? Like, it’s okay.

Andrea Mango [00:18:26]:
You need a red straw. Okay, I know what a red straw. Wait, you need a box this big. But they have the idea in their head. So thinking about what is actually and where can you do this in your curriculum, you probably can’t do this everywhere, but where in your curriculum can you give up a little bit of control, a little bit of power to say, I need them? Almost like I said earlier, how I structure my steam lessons, I need you to have this criteria. These are the materials. This is your time limit. How do you want to put it out there into the world? Something about that choice.

Andrea Mango [00:19:00]:
Every single time when I do it with kids, it just brings them alive. So can you do that with everything? No, but I’ve had a lot of good success with being able to do that with students who aren’t engaged, and then next time they look for it even more.

Matthew Worwood [00:19:15]:
And it’s something in my work that I’ve kind of promoted as this idea of teacher creativity. Part of that is the ability to identify the problems that you can’t address, but also identify the opportunities that exist in your classroom to address a problem or to make a change. And it sounds to me that you’re someone who’s actually very good at that, whether it’s through reflection or through. It’s your passion. You seem to walk in, interact with your curriculum, interact in your classroom environment, and you see opportunities. How do we help other teachers see the opportunities that you see?

Andrea Mango [00:19:50]:
I think that one thing would be to tell teachers that they are creative. I know that Cindy and I, we just reminisced about this yesterday, but there was a time that even though I’ve trained in theater and I sing and I dance and I do all these things that I didn’t feel like I was creative anymore. I was sort of bogged down by politics of the building and by the curriculum, by things, all these things that are kind of against you at times. And I didn’t feel creative. And I guess empowering teachers even, too, to say you are creative, even the way that you organize a lesson. I taught kindergarten for ten years, so I kind of build everything off of then, because in kindergarten you have to do everything in tiny little increments. But I still carry that into my steam lab. Even going up to fourth grade, like thinking of the way you’re going to structure your lesson, are you going to having them sitting there the whole time, are they going to be moving? Are you going to be doing some hands on? So I think that telling teachers and empowering them to say you are creative, even just finding an activity is creative.

Andrea Mango [00:20:56]:
Taking something that someone else has made and making it work for your students, that’s actually being creative. You just, even listening to this podcast is you saying, oh my gosh, I have some creativity in myself and I want to bring it out more. I mean, just explaining to them that it is not just being a beautiful singer or dancer or actor and that they can do it. That’s one way I think, that we can kind of empower teachers to feel better about it. Also, I think reaching out and having other people even outside of your building, I was always collaborating with teachers inside of my building. But now as a steam educator, I’ve been reaching out because I’m the only one in my building that’s doing steam. There are six of us in the district and you just get so busy. So it’s hard to always be in contact with people at other buildings.

Andrea Mango [00:21:49]:
And I’ve kind of built up my Twitter account and I’ve connected with a lot of other teachers and it’s amazing to see the other ideas. So, I mean, I think just even getting out there and hearing what other people are doing, taking little ideas and noticing. I was just even thinking about this birthday writing. A lot of elementary teachers do these birthday books. It doesn’t have to be this huge thing to make something new and having them make a birthday book or whatever it is, but we used to do with our, know, interview the birthday person. Sounds so easy. I know, Matt, you’re working with college kids. This is what elementary teachers do, right? We interview the birthday kid.

Andrea Mango [00:22:26]:
So birthday book is. Every kid writes a little birthday know, like, I hope you have a good birthday, and you get an know. And then you put all of them together. They draw a little cute picture. You put them together, and then when the parents read it, it’s, I hope you get an iPad. I hope you get an, I have a good birthday. So with my class, we used to do my second grade class, and you could totally do this with older grades. We used to interview the student, find out their favorites, and then we’d say, there is no limit on money.

Andrea Mango [00:22:59]:
There’s no limit on time. You can go anywhere in the world, be with anybody at all. So they would come up with, like, oh, yeah, I would love to meet Taylor Swift, or, I would love know this, that the other thing. And I would know, love to be in Hawaii. Right? So then the kids, we would challenge them, and we would come up all these ideas, know, I hope you get to swim in a pool of chocolate pudding, and you and Taylor Swift get to play on the iPad while sunning yourself on the beach in Hawaii. Well, yeah, it’s kind of crazy and it’s silly, but it is creative writing. Then now you’re practicing some creative writing. It makes for an interesting book.

Andrea Mango [00:23:37]:
It’s sending a message to the kids that you can be silly when you’re doing your work. You’re creating that climate with the kids. So, I mean, even something like that is a fun way to engage your students and give them choice. Another great idea. A lot of teachers do a lot of class behaviors, charts. And so at one point, it’s not my favorite thing to do, but I have used this program called Class Dojo. So class dojo has all the kids have this little avatar, and they can earn points at different things. So if they’re being kind, you can give them a point.

Andrea Mango [00:24:11]:
If you see they’re working hard, you can give them a point. You can take away points, but it’s never a good way to encourage a positive classroom environment by taking points away. Just saying. But we used to sit. I had a co teacher that worked with me because I had a lot of students that were english language learners, and we would sit with the kids and we’d brainstorm all the different ways that they could earn something that week. So it’s like, okay, if you as a class, earn x amount of points, 200 points, or whatever it is, what is it that you want to earn? And they would come up with stuff. And this is hence the reason why I got pied in the face once. One of the suggestions was, and this wasn’t the first week, but if you can see that? Obviously, even that kid coming up with the idea, having the urge to say to the teacher, I think we should be able to pie you in the face.

Andrea Mango [00:25:03]:
It must mean that we were open. We had a good communication. They knew that we could laugh it off. They knew I could say no. But me and my co teacher looked at each other and they’re like, absolutely. So it’s one of the best experiences I had. And actually, oh, and this is one of those amazing moments. I just had a student two weeks ago send me an email and this personal email that he’s in 8th grade.

Andrea Mango [00:25:25]:
He was actually in that class where we pied me in the face and he said that he just always remembers my class and how much fun we had and all the things we did and that he’s going off to high school and he wishes he could bring me with him. Like, oh, as a teacher, that’s like those moments, right? That you’re just like, oh, you don’t get that all the time. And the fact that he’s in 8th grade and he was looking back and reflecting and remembering second grade is a huge thing.

Cyndi Burnett [00:25:51]:
So, Andrea, how do you take your problem solving attitude and bring it into your classroom?

Andrea Mango [00:25:57]:
I definitely am open with the kids. Last year, when I started the steam program, I didn’t have desks until December, and I was building a brand new program, writing the curriculum with a couple of other steam teachers in the district. So everything was brand new. But I remember I was pushing out into their classrooms thinking my desk would maybe arrive. And then finally I said to myself, I’ve got to problem solve this. This is what I’m asking the kids to do. So I brought them in. And then every time I would have a lesson, I would tell them, you know what? I needed us to have flat surfaces, so I had to work through steam and think to myself, okay, what can I do? So every kid has a flat surface.

Andrea Mango [00:26:39]:
Oh, we’re all going to use clipboards on the floor. Okay, I need now little tables or stuff. So I’m very open with the kids about what I might be struggling through. I had a fourth grade lesson where we were doing all about the cornea and the eye and the idea that our eye sees the image upside down and then it gets flipped. And so I had found this amazing experiment where they had to flip it, and I kept testing it and testing it and testing it, and I could not get it to work. And I just think it was hysterical because I had an entire day of fourth grade coming up and I was going into it not knowing if anything was going to work or if it was going to be a complete flop. And I told the kids and then I gave it to them as a challenge. I was like, see if you can make this work.

Andrea Mango [00:27:22]:
And wouldn’t, you know, they made it work. They absolutely made it work. And they made it work several different ways that I had never tried. So I think being open and honest with them, that you make mistakes. I always tell them too. If I don’t know something, I might look it up. It’s okay for you to look things know. Why do we have to memorize everything? That’s what Google is for.

Matthew Worwood [00:27:48]:
So, Andrea, first of all, Cindy and I thank you for being such an avid listener of the podcast. We really appreciate it. So you probably know this final question, which is coming up. We ask everyone to share three tips that teachers can go away and either execute or think about relevant to their classroom environment.

Andrea Mango [00:28:03]:
My first tip is there’s so much already on your plate as teachers, it’s nearly impossible to make some big changes. So I would say start small and challenge yourself to maybe get rid of one worksheet a week, maybe one or two then. So instead of having kids write spelling words, why can’t they make it with play doh, why can’t they write it in sand? Instead of using a worksheet, can you instead have them play a math game? Can they move around the room to vote for the answers to a worksheet or ask them to draw something or act something out? So try to, as an educator, get rid of one worksheet a week and then see if you can build from there. I think my second one would definitely be to try to give up some power. Does it really make a difference if they use markers? Does it really make a difference if they sit at their desks? Does it make a difference if they work with their best friend? Where are the areas that you can give up a little bit of control so they can have a little bit of power? And I think my third one is use your number one resource for creativity. It’s your students. They are far more creative sometimes than I can ever be. They are dying to have a voice in the classroom.

Andrea Mango [00:29:17]:
They are also coming at things at a different age. I am not going to mention how old I am, even though Cindy said we’ve known each other for 30 years, but my students are somewhere between maybe four and ten. They’re coming at things at a different viewpoint than I am. So they can see things in a whole nother way. They can actually inspire me. So those are my three tips. And I hope I’ve given some educators some ideas today. I hope they continue to challenge themselves and to believe in themselves and give themselves some grace because they are doing amazing things, even if they’re not recognized for it all the time.

Cyndi Burnett [00:29:51]:
Well, Andrea, thank you so much for joining us today. And if you like what Andrea had to say, you should definitely check out some of her videos on Twitter. You can follow her at Andrea Mango one. While you’re there, follow Matt and I. You can look us up on Twitter as well and make sure you use the hashtag fueling creativity to tell us about what you thought of the show today.

Matthew Worwood [00:30:14]:
And finally, I think everyone can hear the benefit of when we get incredible, passionate educators on the show who just want to express and talk about all the creativity that exists in their classroom. So if you can identify with Andrea and you want to be on our show to talk about your creativity, please reach out to Cindy and myself at questions@fuelingcreativitypodcast.com my name is Dr. Matthew Werwood.

Cyndi Burnett [00:30:37]:
And my name is Dr. Cindy Burnett. This episode was produced by Creativity and education in partnership with warwoodclassroom.com. Our editor is Sina Yusefzade.